Did you know that Holy Wednesday's known as Spy Wednesday, marking the clandestine treachery of Judas who made a bargain with the High priest for thirty pieces of silver to betray Jesus. According to Catholic Culture:
In Poland, the young people throw an effigy of Judas from the top of a church steeple. Then it is dragged through the village amidst hurling sticks and stones. What remains of the effigy is drowned in a nearby stream or pond.
Judas hanged himself and the Book of Acts recounts that his body burst open on falling to the ground on what became known as the "field of blood." So much for the "son of perdition." Traitors might want to take this salutary tale to heart.
Cheers,
LSP
15 comments:
I've felt that Judas got a bad rap. Yeah, he did wrong, but wasn't it foretold that one of Jesus' followers was going to betray him? If so, that meant 'free will' wasn't available to Judas. Someone had to do it. Jesus wasn't going to climb up on the cross and kill himself.
And, really, when you think about it, he did pay for it. Physically and spiritually. Would Jesus, post-resurrection, forgive him? (Probably not while he was suffering and dying on the cross, though, considering his harsh (for him) words to his dad...)
I mean, if there's free will, what would have happened if none of the disciples or close followers had betrayed Jesus? And if it was foreordained, then there was no free will involved so Judas really wasn't guilty, right?
Like Pontious Pilate, just doing his job and people have a hatred for him as strong as a burning bush.
Unsung anti-heroes or not-quite-villains.
Now, Herod? Yeah, guilty.
Pedo Joe does like his ice cream and underaged kids. Does 10% for the big guy equate to 30 pieces of silver? At spot valuation of $28/oz, 30 "pieces of silver" would be worth approximately $91 to $441 in present-day value (USD) depending on which coin was used.
Hunter spent a lot more than that on one evening of whores and coke.
The comments are as interesting as the post....
X2 Beans, well stated...my take as well. We have to read between the lines of Scripture with these more historical accounts, especially this one. It was foretold, and yes, someone had "to do the deed", otherwise it doesn't happen as stated. I remind myself that these were also men of the time, hand selected by Jesus to unfurl the New Covenant, even if painful in process.
In the end we all have our flaws, weaknesses, and poor judgement moments...God uses them for His purpose, and this was Judas' as Christ needed him...otherwise, as Paul reminds us, "Your faith is in vain."
Paul M. Excellent response and answer. But... you know... questions about said fortoldness.
Which, being foretold and foreordained, did Jesus know what was coming, since he was/is part of God? Or was that blocked off from him during his earthly stay?
And if he did know, did he know Judas was 'the one?' How much of what happened from birth to death and after did he know, just the highlights or every second of every day?
Or was the 'foretold' just justification after the fact? How much of His story has been manipulated after the fact, with The Big Guy's wishes or not?
And exactly when did 'Free Will' take over from Fortold and Pre-Arranged Destiny? Was it His death that set us fee from Destiny along with all our past and generational sins?
Mind boggling stuff, twisted philosophy wrapped up in warped reality.
And, yes, I believe in God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit, the Holy Trinity, Three is One and One is Three.
Just... Questions. I have questions. Big list of questions. Lots and lots of questions. We can talk, argue, discuss, pontificate and debate, but they're the questions that can only be answered by Him or His and, considering what happens to people on this earthly plane that get direct answers from Him or His, I'll wait until I'm dust in the wind and heading away from said earthly plane before asking whomever I get to ask the questions.
Till then, I'll believe and question. Because a good and just God allows us to question.
We all have questions, and it is not heresy to ask them.
Paul, speaking of pre-destination, says that God hardened Pharaoh's heart.
It's been argued that the application of God's Word to same hearts has that effect.
It may be that Judas' biggest sin was to not ask for forgiveness.
@Beans...anyone who doesn't question their Faith isn't thinking hard enough. Yours is really terrific discourse that can plagued even the stalwart Biblical minds. In the end "we will know for certain."
@Ed...agreed, I believe his fear turned into despair that caused the lack of asking, his end was not pretty. His is a reminder to all of us in our quiet time to present ourselves humbly to Him and ask forgiveness, but not in a self-flogging way. I like to say "What God wants most is our acknowledgment."
Paul M.
I learned from the best. My wife went from fundie Christian (which, in reality, wasn't very Christian at all) to converting to Judaism to converting to Roman Catholic. Her conversion to Judaism was hard, took lots of skull sweat and studying and lots of conversation with the Rabbi.
On the other hand, the poor baby priest gave her a conversion book that seemingly was written on a 5th grade level and she would spear said baby priest with serious deep questions. It got so bad that the head priest had to rescue said baby priest and instead of doing the annointing of oils and crossing of forehead at Easter, like they normally did, her formal conversion was the following Sunday.
And me being the ah, er, anal muscle that I am, I sat in the corner and listened. And joined in on the serious questions as soon-to-be-wife was asking some very thought provoking questions. Like, oh, so you acknowledge the Word of God and want to be saved by being converted and such, so what happens to your soul if you die before the formal conversion takes place? (Answer, of course, is as soon as you acknowledge God as supreme and Jesus Christ as your Lord and Saviour, you're saved. Formality is just window dressing. A question said baby priest really couldn't answer and the one that tipped the head priest to scheduling the formalities forthwith.)
Really, I think I got it earlier about 10years old or so, when I got into an argument with my mother about the existence of God (the heathen teachers already had the hooks in on 'God doesn't exist) and it all came down to, not the depth and breathe of existence, but on what started everything. At 10 years old, it came down to "Something had to flip the switch. Stuff had to come from somewhere." And thus my philosophical and existential journey seriously began.
As to Judas asking for forgiveness, he may have, or not. We don't know because, like many suicidal people, he slabbed himself outside of human contact. And that may be one of the things that got left out at the Nicean Conference in 325.
Have to chalk it up to one of the mysteries of the whole thing. God knows, maybe Satan, everyone else is just guessing until they go to Heaven.
Good comments, Beans. It's very similar to what happened to me, but it was the "Good Nuns" that "taught" me would just blow off questions like that when I asked them.
I've lost track of how many times I've been labeled as an atheist because I was a "Man Of Science".
I see no conflict in believing in God, and being a "scientist". They are NOT mutually exclusive.
Interesting spot precious metal point, LL. Maybe we should convert the "pieces" to "talents" to get a more accurate value on the The Big Guy's 10%.
What shall it profit a man?
drjim, the comments are far more interesting than the post! Saying that, a demonic Old Crook falling on ice cream's always good value.
Have to question, Beans, otherwise we become fossilized, which is bad. And I feel a bit sorry for the Baby Priest! Of course they do go on with some pretty infantile, ahem, catechesis, "Look, here's a coloring book of Jesus!"
That aside, did Judas have free will? For that matter, does anyone, given that God's knowledge is necessary and absolute.
Aquinas argues that we do, because God's knowledge is present tense, eternal, and even unerring present knowledge of a contingent event doesn't make it any the less contingent.
Did Judas begin to understand what he'd done and was crushed under the enormity of his evil? Perhaps, he certainly despaired.
Ed, "It's been argued that the application of God's Word to same hearts has that effect."
It certainly does, think how the Gospel enrages people, just as the Word, Christ, enraged the Sanhedrin, to say nothing of Satan himself.
Paul, God certainly used Judas' death dealing wickedness for life and glory.
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